Firefighter Overtime

  When a firefighter calls in sick, that 24 hour shift has to be filled.  That causes overtime.  In years past, firefighter overtime spending has been over budget.  In fact in one year, the Lake Charles Fire Department paid over two million dollars in overtime to its firemen.  And that's cause for alarm according to new Fire Chief Keith Murray.  Murray says there's been extreme abuse of the overtime policy.  But steps are now in place to address the issue.  And they seem to be working.  For example, in years past, the sick leave hours were near 52,000.  This year it's down to around 30,000 hours.  Chief Murray expects that number to continue to drop.  What's your reaction to that much money being spent on overtime pay for firemen?

Comments

[Tammy P.]

If paying them over time is keeping our city safe PAY IT!!!!

[Richard]

First of all I would like the press to get the whole unedited story before running something that is this harming to our firefighters. YES there has been some individuals that have abused sick leave in the past. But in the past the supervisors haven't been doing there JOB and police the problem at hand, so some did take advantage. We have had several firefighters that have had serious medical problems in the past and one has died and another will die soon. Should they count those hours that they were off as ABUSE? They are. Also they count the days that you were scheduled off as hours on sick leave. Kind of seems that those hours are inflated, HUH. They themselves have accounted for some of this so called abuse. I my self have taken 2 days that I can recall in 17 years, is that ABUSE or USE. Fire the ones that you can prove are abusing instead of holding this over the ones that don't and haven't abused it. Im tired of being the punching bag of the city. We deserve the respect from our elected officials and are tired of being treated like criminals. We work for little to no pay, we deal with the things that others cant, we keep insurance ratings down for our citizens and businesses, we respond every time you call, others call us when they cant get there fast enough, and we do all of this everyday no matter what. There are always going to be some bad apples in the basket. Get rid of them and stop using it against us. Then what would our elected officials say the reason is to not pay us or treat us with respect. All city employees better watch there backs the mayor is coming for y'all next!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! OOOOOOO yah we are also highly understaffed, why not find out that story.

[Suzanne]

Exactly as said above, they have had a few fireman out on extended sick leave and a family has lost a loved one and another is to follow shortly! This isn't abuse, this is sad! You have to take into consideration that when these men take sick leave, even one day, it counts as 24 hours and then the day after that is counted because they were scheduled off anyway, so there's 48 hours right there. I wish that people would get the WHOLE story with this, but that's not happening here!

[not fooled]

Thank you, Richard. You cleared up a common misconception that would have otherwise been ignored. KPLC's story is very bias. In every profession, there will be slackers and dishonest people...BUT, there will also be honest and hard working people. Get rid of the slackers and it will make everyone's job easier. It really seems like the mayor has it out for the Fire Dept. Thank you LC Fire Dept. for all you do!

[Raymond May]

When the media gets involved in politics, they (the media ) broadcast what the politicans tell them to put out. The media needs to keep thier print to facts, not to what they are told to say.KPLC is a prime example of Liberal propaganda, it sucks up to the politicans to get raitings higher.Its sad when a person has devoted his life to keeping this city safe and comes down with a deadly illness is treated like a criminal. Mayor Roach needs to stop wasting money on all the stupid projects at the civic center and pay the firemen and police thier due.What if your house catches fire and all the firemen have quit to find better paying jobs ??? Just think about it.........

[POd taxpayer]

Take ALL city / parish services and put them out for PUBLIC - Private contracts - The savings would be enormous , waste would be slashed , accountability would be to a business , because services are business and not recreation. All should pay SS taxes , no more separate benefit schemes and NO MORE UNIONS

[Marie]

The liberal sick leave policies contribute to the problem and abuse. 356 days a year of paid sick leave is outrageous. Implement a sick leave policy that reflects what everyone else has to work with in regular employment. The first day missed is NOT paid. Paid sick leave kicks in only on the second day. Totalpaid sick leave should be limited to 6 to 9 weeks for the year. If the firefighter is still sick then his co-workers can take up a collection to help him financially. This is the way it is done in the everyday working world. Although with the $500,000+ PARTIAL payment of the lawsuit the city is shelling out to firefighters I would think that money should be no problem to them. And yet every year they are back at the table demanding more and more concessions from the city. If you bite the hand that feeds you often enough eventually you will find the hand empty.

[Richard]

The 365 was instituted into Civil Service Law years ago. It was intended to protect Firefighters from loss of pay due to injuries or illness. That is not without saying that there were some few that took advantage of this protection and ABUSED this benefit. But there are far more out there that have not. I still say fire those who are and leave the rest alone. Then what? They would just try to find something else to persecute us. You mentioned the law suit, Im guessing you have something to do with city hall and thats fine but put your self in our shoes. If something is owed to you wouldn't you go after it. I mean if it wasn't owed then a judge wouldn't have ruled in our favor. Let the lawsuit go its over. Even before the suit we were not being treated fairly. Our starting out firefighters were getting barely above minimum wage and most were available to get federal assistance, our veteran firefighters were given more responsibility with the same low pay. Is that fair? Over 17 years I have attended several City, Federal, & privately paid classes to improve the services that I give to our tax payers. I don't even get a pat on the back for these. Is that right? I should just be glad I have a job in this day and age right. I agree thats why money didn't even get addressed in this contract. Lake Charles has very good and experienced Fire Fighters and I think anyone that unfortunately needed our services has been more than appreciative. We do more with less everyday and just would like to see city hall give us the respect we deserve. I DONT CALL IN SICK and my family has been serving this city for more than 60 years in three generations and I think it is OUTRAGEOUS "as so quoted above" that you put me in the same category as someone that does ABUSE the system. Just think, if this was a perfect world and no one ABUSED the system and everything was working the way it was intended would you be behind us as the majority of our citizens are? There would still be a overtime bill because to keep our current insurance rating we need to staff a minimum amount of trucks and stations. Our department is not properly staffed at this time and cant cover that. That is why OT is accrued. By the way today there is only one person on extended sick leave for a broken hand that is not even on our shift and there are still 5 beginning FF positions that are being held over for OT. Did sick leave abuse cause this or under staffing. Looks like that is more of a planning problem. Make that benefits better and hire more than the minimum required to staff the fire Department then OT will nonexistent.

[Bettie]

As another typical business approach to a common problem, only a few are taking advantage of, they won't address the ones that are doing it because they are scared of a lawsuit from some unethical lawyer. Reprimand or fire the ones that are abusing it and that should help. Administration needs to toughen up and take a stand, not hide behind a generic memo or generic announcement. You know who the ones are that abuse it, and the ones that don't should be praised for doing what they were hired to do. This goes on in every company, and they handle it as poorly as the city is attempting to do. It's really sad.

[Katrina]

The city broke the law. They chose not to listen to reason and were sued as a result. The law said the fireman were own back pay because the the city reduced the salary for the sole reason that the state began to pay supplemental pay. The city would inflate the actual starting pay during the first year and reduce it after one year, when the state pay would kick in. State law plainly stated this was not to be done and the city and their lawyers "wisely" chose to do otherwise. So don't bring up a lawsuit, when you were the one clearly in the wrong.
We are dealing with fanatics at city hall. All they say is that there is abuse. But it just is not true. A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject. Keep beating your head against the wall and see where that gets you.

[Buck]

People wake up!!! The Roach Administration is trying to put blame anywhere they can. The fact is that this city is in financial crises. We are 10 milion dollars in the hole, with the possibility of another 5 million next year. This crises is the direct results of irresponsible management from Roach and the Lake Charles City Council. The tax payers of this city need to hold these elected official responsible, not the firefighters.

[marvin]

How much is a life worth ? Every penny spent is worth it.

[Dirty]

First I would like to address Ms. Marie, you are extremely misinformed and uneducated. Have you ever seen a structure fire or a residential fire where fire fighters show up and extinguish the fire? Apparently, you have not otherwise you would understand and witness first hand the extreme and stressful situations these guys put themselves in to protect you and your property you work so very hard for. It is a very demanding and stressful job, that they do. I know a few fire fighters in this city and I also know that this year alone, there is one fire fighter who passed from cancer that was linked to his job, one who has received news that he does not have long to live and another who is also fighting cancer and trying to go back to work. I challenge you Marie to take a look at what these guys do and the limits they push themselves to and beyond and ask yourself if 365 days is too much. This city has been unfair with the fire dept. and its personnel for far too long. This needs to stop, those guys put themself out there for you. Give them a fair shake.

[JL]

First let me say I support our local firemen. They do a job that most would run from...how many of you would go into a burning building? They serve you for very little pay. Most have to have a second job to help support them and their families. Like other working people, firemen are entitled to vacation and sick leave. When someone takes vacation or sick leave at the fire department then someone else has to work their position. (and remember their shifts are 24 hours not 8 hours) As for the number of hours of sick leave used each year, when a fireman is sick their hours are counted as consecutive days. For those of you who work a 40 hour week, how would you like to loose 24 hours of sick leave when you are sick on Friday. This is how the firemens sick hours are counted, 24 hours starting from the day you miss until you come back to work. Since the fire department is short handed (and has been for the past 25 years) that means people work up (Driver for a Captain; Hoseman for a Driver), which the fire department has been doing for years. This is NOT a new policy that the new fire chief has come up with. The City needs to hire more firemen, but in order to do this they need to give these men the pay they deserve. There are people that abuse sick leave in every business, don't put up with the abuse. Get rid of the people that abuse the system and keep the ones that do their jobs. I know that is easier said than done, but TRY. As for the fire department shutting a ladder truck down due to lack of personnel, that is a good idea until a fire happens in the service area where that Ladder truck is located. In the end the City needs to hire more firemen and give them the incentive to WANT to stay.

[Valerie Delaney]

The overtime may be a lot BUT if my house is on fire or if the firemen are needed for some other reason I appreciate the fact that the department is there. In no other business would time scheduled off be counted as sick leave (and it should not be). Firemen work hard and put their lives at risk and should get compensation for this.

[MC]

amen to all the people who realize and recognize that there are always people who abuse sick leave no matter where you go. the city council keeps complaining about having to pay overtime and about how they have no budget; but they would rather pay the significant amount of overtime to lay off a pointless amount of employees. it makes no sense to complain about overtime in one area and agree to it in another area when in the long run it would be less money for the two employees to keep working and the overtime would be completely eliminated. the employees that are looking for and searching for ways around sick policies and other regulations should be immediately eliminated. different policies and regulations are being put in place in different areas of this department and they all contradict each other. having the firemen work up to eliminate overtime but paying an extremely crazy amount of overtime so that you can make a small department even smaller. it makes no sense and something should be done. the city council and the mayor should be moved out of the picture and someone who can make some real decisions should be put in place. these firemen work their butts off everyday. no matter what they do. they do a job no ordinary person would want to voluntarily do. they put themselves in harms way to protect and try to preserve others homes and belongings. they dont work a normal, 8hr day shift like other people. they are always willing and always ready. they earn every minute of 365 days of sick leave. in times like this, people would rather keep the jobs they have then have to be sent out into the job market to look for another. i believe John Cardone was quoted saying that other departments in the city are laying people off and thats not what they want to do. but thats exactly what they are doing. this minimial amount of employees is not going to make a difference. but the overtime that the city council would be paying out would be. almost twice the amount of a salaried employee. when stations starting getting shut down and trucks are run at minimal capacity i guess the city will wonder why the taxes and homeowners insurance is going up. perhaps then someone will care.

[MC]

and to mary...the fire department is not the only department that goes into negotiations...the police department does too and they had a lawsuit against the city also...perhaps you're one track mind forgot that...

[Upset in LC]

It is so nice to see that there are people in the city of Lake Charles willing to support the firefighters. It is sad to see several of our firefighters fighting for their lives makes me wonder if the danger of the job is to blame. I bet they don't think so and would do it again. And as for Marie I don't think she is getting the full picture or she is just ignorant to the facts. Yes, a lawsuit was settled but it was due to the firefighters. I bet if Marie was owed money she would want to receive it. I know I would. How about spending money on overtime to keep our city safe instead of planting the palms and having those outrageous priced ducks at the civic center. I want to thank those men and women who keep our city safe. I also want everyone to keep several of our firefighters in your prayers as they are fighting not only for our city but for their lives.

[Jennifer Garner]

I am so angery! My husband, Nathan Garner, was one of the most faithful employes the city has ever had. He was NOT appreciated at all by our city officials. He died May 26th due to Burkitt's Non-Hodgkins Lymphoma, one of the most common cancers our firemen die from. He went to work on a Friday and was scheduled to be off on a Saturday, but becuase he was paid so little he felt we needed this one day of overtime and he worked. All the while sick. He came home on that Sunday and was diagnosed on that Monday. He was put into the hospital right away. He had lost half his blood supply. Did he abuse sick leave? I think not, he began a fight for his life. Is 365 days of sick leave to much? I think not. Nathan never used everyday but I was grateful he had it. One of the worst part was listening to him worry about his job, becuase he would be using so much sick leave. It is a shame that these men can't go to the job they love and know that our city officals are supporting them. I will say this for every LC Firemen, Randy Roach and his administration does not support the firemen. Nathan will not be the last to die of cancer, but hopefully he will be the last to have to go to work sick because he is afraid to miss a day because he may be penalized. This is not a new subject, these guys have always been underpaid.

[concerned citizen]

Jennifer, I am sorry for your recent lost and I respect your husband as a fireman and thank him for all he did for our city... It is stories like that that the people of lake charles need to hear, not Roach and his friend john on tv complaining about overtime. lets look at the facts, Roach "claims" that the city is in a 4 million dollar hole for this year, 1. This is not fact, this it a PROJECTED claim. 2. over all the years our city has been so healthy and making money from taxes and new businesses, why is it that NOW they are worried about 4 million dollars?????? what happen to all the money made in past years?? where did it go? 3 geese at the board walk? a couple of palm trees? or maybe our trusty city officials back pockets, who knows, and im not pointing fingers, but seems to me like the city is like a little kid with his first allowance and would rather buy junk, then put it in the bank for a rainy day......once again, THANK YOU to all the fireman in our city, we appreciate what you do and all you go through for so little.

[Wife of Former Firefighter]

My first comment is for Jennifer, my thoughts and prayers are with you. My husband spoke very fondly of Nate and knows what a hard worker he is.
Next, I would like to address Marie. You would like the fire dept. to work like "regular" workers. Ok, lets explore that. First, this would include hazard pay, correct? It's my understanding that people who work extremely hazardous jobs with high injury risks get hazard pay. Next, most regular jobs I know of work 8hrs a day not 24. The "regular jobs" usually pay a shift differential for less desirable shift times. So, tack that on too. That, by the way, would be on top of an already higher than average hourly rate determined by the large amounts of education and training a person has to retain to do this job. I could go on and on.
Firefighting is not a "regular" job. There are going to be "abusers of the system" no matter where you are. It is really hard to appreciate the sacrifice these people make to do this job unless you have been there. As the wife of a former firefighter, i take offense to anyone who suggests that firefighters are greedy. The lawsuit, my friend, was for pay that the firefighters EARNED but weren't payed. To suggest that "money should be no problem" because they got what they earned is ignorant. This is a physically, mentally, and financially hard job.
If the media wants a story, maybe they should research LC firefighter divorce rates due to the strains on the family or maybe the rate of injury.

[Heather]

Mr Mayor,

Take care of the people that take care of you and this city. Stop dumping the money into the lakefront!

Sincerely,
Angry Citizen

[Tax Paying Citizen]

The city always puts the fire dept on the chopping block first when it comes to budget cuts. It's because the FD doesn't generate any revenue, they look at it as just a big money pit an expense. Well what they don't realize is the FD is like insurance. No one likes paying it but you have to for your safety. because when you need it you sure do hope you've got the best protection possible. Does anyone take into consideration how much money we save the city/businesses/public/homeowners on insurance? Because of our ISO rating and great fire protection we provide the FD makes it affordable for businesses like walmart, restaurants, and the casino/hotels to be able to do business here in LC. Does anyone know that we also provide protection to Ward 3 dist 2? (old cajun country run area) No not many people know about that, the LCFD covers so much with so little and yet the city continues to take more and more from the budget and refusal to give any respect to those men who put their lives on the line everyday. And to go even further they take more and more benefits away, like a slap in the face. Remember when the hurricanes come, who is out there doing rescues, cutting trees to clear roadways, putting out fires, cutting people out of wrecked cars, responding to medical emergencies when acadian can't get on scene in time (when we don't even run MEDICAL calls), the hazardous materials calls that we deal with, and so forth. There is so much the LCFD does for the city and the citizens but so little is told to the public. Remember, your firefighters are Civil (civilian, citizens, local people) Servants (protect and serve) working for you the people. They'll always be there regardless of how they're treated because that's the type of people they are.

[Moi]

I agree with Heather...

[Mike]

Don't blame the firefighter for an inept management team. Supervision should go after the individual abusers of the system. So often managers or supervisors use a "shotgun blast" style of corrective action that targets everyone...even the good employee because they refuse to confront the person or persons causing the problem. Morale will surely suffer when this is allowed to continue.